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Post by GottMitUns on Oct 29, 2011 2:26:28 GMT 1
Cheers, fellow BK'ers. There's another question bothering me, where I just don't seem like being able to find a sollution for... Actually, my whole problem is pretty much described here, just without any sollution to it: bkpforums.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=4684&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&sid=ff77ebc85abdae421f2581028d56ade4&start=30After trying around with the random- map- thingy for several times, I managed to create a working, 10*10 - bzm file. Now, creating a random- map that's even bigger than 10*10 was my next wish... I researched a bit "how to" and found Louis, actually pretty helpfull tutorial. But now, my problem is the same as the mapper in above listed thread had. After unzipping the whole content of my data.pak, I tried to load one of the templates into the templates- composer. I clicked add... I was able to find the unzipped version of the templates in the menu that had just opened up... But no matter if I double- click the highlighted item or if I use the "open"- button. Nothing changes. I'm just getting sent back to my template- composer, without any changes. I'm not getting any error- reports as well. And the same problem I do have with the graphs and the graph- composer. Does anyone maybe know what exactly my problem (... with the random map editor ;D) is??? Or, even better, could anyone send me over a modified version of one graph and one template, enabling me to do random- maps in, let's say 20*20 or 21*21??? Thanks in advance and Greetz from Deutschland.
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Post by LouisXIV on Oct 29, 2011 11:21:02 GMT 1
Well, that (BKPortal) was a long time ago.
As I have said somewhere else, getting a well-detailed random map of greater than 14x14 is nearly impossible, and you can only do it by "tricking" the RMG.
The RMG starts to throw random abortions at you somewhere about 12x12 or 13x13, depending on the number of nodes and connections you have on your graph. You can make a desert map easily that is as big as 32x32 as long as you only have a few nodes and connections on it. One start node, one large settlement node and one small, maybe a troops-site and finally a warehouse, with a road connecting them all. Lots of space to manouevre.
To your problem: What I am doing now and have been for a long time is extracting the Scenarios folder from the data.pak and placing it in my Blitzkrieg\Run\data folder. This way I have easy access to Blitzkrieg\Run\data\scenarios via the MapEd and the various tools in it, the graphs editor, the templates editor and the fieldsets editor.
You can't properly work on the Scenarios folder while it is still in the data.pak, although you can edit some of the .xml files in it.
With the Scenarios folder in your data folder, the BK game engine will automatically pick up any changes you make to your Scenarios setup (unless there is something like a Scenarios.pak in your data folder.) You can also quickly create a Scenarios.pak in your data folder. Just right-click on the Scenarios folder itself and click on "Add to archive." Then click on "zip" and change the .zip suffix to .pak, and the Scenarios.pak will automatically get placed in your Run\data folder.
Try putting the Scenarios folder there and see if it makes a difference. Get back to me and I'll give you all the help you need to make random maps.
Meanwhile I'll see if I can dig up a working larger random map graph-and-template for you.
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Post by LouisXIV on Oct 29, 2011 11:37:44 GMT 1
Add-on: For manageability, you can delete everything in your new Run\data\Scenarios folder except the graphs and templates folders. That will cut out a lot of bulk. Or instead ....
I found this Scenarios.pak in my miscellaneous storage area. I'm pretty sure it is an older but stabilized version of the graphs and templates enlarged by about 3 sizes (from 8x8 to 11x11). It also has modified patches so that there is more variety and there are more units - both offensive and defensive - on the map, and many of the objectives are much harder. It also has modified context files for more realistic setups. The air action is much more frequent as well, but if you don't like that you can just delete the Chapters folder.
One other thing I've done with it is eliminate the mixed nationality for the Allies. Either you get British troops and equipment or U.S., not both.
This may be for Rolling Thunder and not Blitzkrieg, I'm not sure, but I don't think it is. Drop or open it into your Run\data folder and try it out.
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Post by GottMitUns on Oct 29, 2011 16:25:29 GMT 1
First of all, thanks for quick replying. I've unzipped my scenarios- folder to a different location. When I'm back home tonite (after working ), I'll copy and paste em over into the Run/data - folder. Maybe that'll make a difference. Also, I guess I could have posted my problem in better words... My aim is not creating a complete working map with script. I just want a .bzm- files. Also, I'll heavily modify the map to my needs afterwards. There'll be nearly none of the stock- BK units anyways... Also, in my "own- mod" I'm using ranges pretty close orientated at MK, so thanks for that Scenarios.pak, but maps in 8*8 or 11*11 are actually pretty useless to me. This one 10*10 map I created is rather special, as it's going to be all infantry with only light support weapons. You see, it's all about creating a .bzm- file in 20*20 or even bigger. That's why I'm trying to create/ get a modified graph and a template. Greetz and thanks again from Hamburg.
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Post by LouisXIV on Oct 29, 2011 22:22:20 GMT 1
Large maps with lots of "detail" are almost impossible. However, if you want something for MK-style ranges, this may not be a problem. If you take an 11x11 graph and make it 20x20 with only the same number of nodes and connections, it may well work. Then you can get to work and put more detail on the map manually.
Just call up the graph editor, enlarge the graph and move the nodes out proportionately to match. Save it and the call up the template editor, load the template that controls the graph, delete the graph from the template and load it again, and you're ready to go.
If you do want more detail, you create smaller random (or otherwise) maps and then place them as nodes and use them in a larger random map. That is how these maps were done:
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Post by GottMitUns on Oct 30, 2011 0:22:10 GMT 1
Just call up the graph editor, enlarge the graph and move the nodes out proportionately to match. Save it and the call up the template editor, load the template that controls the graph, delete the graph from the template and load it again, and you're ready to go.
Hmmmm, I already had feared, that you just didn't completely get me... Not having English as mother- tongue at least doesn't make things easier. I wasn't able to do any edits to graphs and templates, as they just wouldn't show up in my composers... But... Copying over the content of "scenarios" into the Run/data- folder of my BK- installation just did solve my problem anyway. Now, both graphs and templates do show up in the editor as they are supposed to do. I'm now able to do any changes I like. I never would have come to the idea, that the editor is actually that "bitchy" (sorry ) about the exact location of those files. Greetz from the Elbe- river.
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Post by LouisXIV on Oct 30, 2011 11:37:36 GMT 1
No, you can edit the Scenarios in almost any location. It's just that this particular location is its "natural" home and the easiest place to work with it.
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Post by GottMitUns on Oct 30, 2011 18:52:12 GMT 1
No, you can edit the Scenarios in almost any location. It's just that this particular location is its "natural" home and the easiest place to work with it. Now, that's strange, as changing the location of those files definetly was the sollution to my problem. I just put the unzipped content of my "scenarios" back to the folder I had it stored in before and again, the composers weren't able to open neither graphs nor templates. They did show up in the "open from" menu but I just couldn't load em into the editor. And I don't seem to be alone with this, as the user in above listed, old BKP- thread had just exactly the same problem. May I ask what version of Windows you are using??? I have XP, maybe that could make the difference. Well, greetz from Hamburg.
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Post by LouisXIV on Oct 31, 2011 10:44:02 GMT 1
Okay, I'm confused.
I have Windows XP Home on my development computer. I have just tried, and you are right, I cannot open graphs on a different hard drive or even an alternate installation of BK on this HD.
Why I am confused is, I know I've had the Scenarios folder in other locations before I discovered this "natural" location. However that was years ago.
But now that you have it working, it doesn't really matter, does it?
So, back to your original problem. Does the Scenarios I gave you work and does it have enlarged maps?
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Post by GottMitUns on Nov 1, 2011 20:59:18 GMT 1
Actually, this by far isn't the first time, the BK- editor makes me shake my head in disbelief. But you're right, as I got it working now, the mission is completed. The "scenarios.pak", that you sent over, really contains some way improved templates and graphs. The maps are still a bit small for my needs, but after doing some more edits to them (hope you're fine with that ), I was able to create a pretty nice, 20*20 random map. A very nice base for further detailing and converting to "my mod" Thanks and greetz from HH.
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Post by danzig70 on Nov 1, 2011 22:14:43 GMT 1
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Post by LouisXIV on Nov 2, 2011 11:40:17 GMT 1
Glad to be of help. I think the RMG can be a great help if used wisely.
I presume you just enlarged the graphs and didn't add anything to them for your 20x20s. As I say, it seems to be the number of nodes and connections that limit the size of a map, not the graph size itself.
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Post by GottMitUns on Nov 2, 2011 13:49:57 GMT 1
@danzig: Thanks for your idea, but the problem seems to be solved by Louis already. LouisXIVYep, just like you said in your tutorial on BKP, I simply enlarged the graph, rearranged the nodes and voila... The map I've got now is admittedly low on detail, but that is something I can help myself with. Greetz from Germany.
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Post by ariete on Sept 4, 2014 13:31:11 GMT 1
hi friends, to don't waste too time in the creation of new scenarios and rather then convert maps already plaied, i thinked to create news missions using the random scenario. i readed the releated guide about that, i just want know if someone can explain me for the various seasons what's mean/what's change in the various templates or graph xml files. example what's change beetween templates 8 and templates 14, just the use of different graphs or in different order?
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Post by ariete on Dec 7, 2014 18:21:28 GMT 1
i created some random maps 15 x 15 in summer season. when i go to make them in winter season, editor don't respect the positions of the main points edited in the graph composer section and create a 15x15 map with only the half covered by those main points (bridge, village, ...). it seems thing don't work with winter map, it continue to make the main objects in map like 8x8 10x10. it's possible? i tried several attempts, both under BK and BHRT
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